FHC #102: Diving deep into value-based care and the need for ‘system-ness’

Time and again, researchers have confirmed that the American healthcare system is ineffective, too expensive and falling further behind its international peers in critical measures of performance.

In this episode of Diving Deep, cohosts Dr. Robert Pearl and Jeremy Corr go in search of medicine’s holy grail: the provision of higher quality care that’s more convenient and more affordable—all at once. In short, this episode focuses on the quest for value-based care.

The journey begins as our hosts explore the recent mega-merger between Kaiser Permanente and Geisinger Health. Could this union help spark a national value-based care movement? Or is that kind of transformative change likelier to come from one of healthcare’s newer entrants (among the most imposing are the retail giants: Amazon, Walmart and CVS).

Other questions answered on today’s show: What are the biggest difficulties Kaiser and Geisinger will need to overcome? What are the hurdles the retail giants will need to overcome to topple healthcare’s incumbent powers? How does system-ness fit into the equation? Why is capitation so important? And which organization(s) will emerge as healthcare’s next superpower?

Click play to learn more or check out the various links below for additional information.


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Dr. Robert Pearl is the author of a book about medicine’s invisible yet highly influential physician culture. Check out “Uncaring: How Physician Culture Is Killing Doctors & Patients.” All profits from the book go to Doctors Without Borders.

Fixing Healthcare is a co-production of Dr. Robert Pearl and Jeremy Corr. Subscribe to the show via Apple, Spotify, Stitcher or wherever you find podcasts. Join the conversation or suggest a guest by following the show on Twitter and LinkedIn.